Dynamic Range & The Loudness War

[Loves2Watch]

So what do you do when all they are interested in is shit pop music.

Love the kids and all, but I'm not going to listen to Bruno Mars, Lady Gaga, and the rest of this shit over and over again.

I have the kids convinced that Z107.7 (St. Louis shit top 40 radio station) doesn't work in my car. I then only play quality music, hopefully they will move away from the crap eventually.

Well, as the saying goes, "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink". This is the case with some or many of the younger as well as older generation so if you find that to be the case, don't waste your time with them but rather find or move on to another who may be open to/able to realize the difference...

[GOS]

Have faith my man. While, my oldest doesn't appreciate a nice stereo, he and my youngest now admit that much of my music is excellent. They still listen to their stuff though....

So what do you do when all they are interested in is shit pop music.

Love the kids and all, but I'm not going to listen to Bruno Mars, Lady Gaga, and the rest of this shit over and over again.

I have the kids convinced that Z107.7 (St. Louis shit top 40 radio station) doesn't work in my car. I then only play quality music, hopefully they will move away from the crap eventually.

[ev666il]

Click here to read Ian Shepherd's comment on a very technical article about the Loudness War which is bound to appear on September's issue of Sound On Sound magazine. Unfortunately, the article is quite open to misinterpreatation by Loudness War supporters, which is I why I've asked Ian to comment it and make things clearer for the least technical users. A link to the original article (which contains an analisys of why Metallica's Death Magnetic sounds that bad) is there as well - but be warned: it's indeed quite technical.

[ev666il]

Do death metal fans hate the Loudness War? Well I'm one and I do! Have a look at this video:



Here is an interview with Rick Rubin, the music producer behind Metallica's Death Magnetic and Red Hot Chili Pepper's Californication among others. He's a "serious audiophile" who admits that sometimes when things are too loud they sound worse on the radio (page 3)... YET he applies tons of dynamic compression to his every mix. He claims his job is doing "A/B comparisons" but I wonder whose ears he does that with... 'cause there's no way an audiophile's ears would ever pick a mix as distorted as Death Magnetic. As per the link in post #37, dynamic compression means nothing on the radio. It could mean something on portable mp3 players but not in all cases, and not below 10db anyway. Seriously, this "war" is getting ridiculous.

Oh, and Rubin's latest creation... a "mastered for iTunes" version of Red Hot Chili Pepper's new album.

[Disco Batman]

Opeth's upcoming album should be free of such trash compression. I believe Steven Wilson mastered it.

[ev666il]

That's what I keep hearing. Besides, I believe Opeth liked Dynamic Range Day on Facebook. What is unclear is whether Steven Wilson did both the mixing AND mastering, or just the mixing. To avoid overcompression, he should be responsible of both. EDIT: if this holds true, that's not bad for a 2011 release (though I'd still wouldn't want to see figures below 10db on metal releases)!

In the meanwhile, I've asked both Europe and Eluveitie whether they'd consider releasing a dynamic version of their upcoming album. Europe's answer has been removing my post from their Facebook wall (sic), whereas I'm still waiting for Eluveitie's response. Somehow, I doubt Threat Signal's album will see a dynamic version being released

[Disco Batman]

That's what I keep hearing. Besides, I believe Opeth liked Dynamic Range Day on Facebook. What is unclear is whether Steven Wilson did both the mixing AND mastering, or just the mixing. To avoid overcompression, he should be responsible of both.

In the meanwhile, I've asked both Europe and Eluveitie whether they'd consider releasing a dynamic version of their upcoming album. Europe's answer has been removing my post from their Facebook wall (sic), whereas I'm still waiting for Eluveitie's response. Somehow, I doubt Threat Signal's album will see a dynamic version being released

I'm not a fan of Death Metal, but if Wilson's work on Opeth's new album mirrors his work on Porcupine Tree if his other projects you should be quite happy with it. He finds a nice balance between DB and dynamics.

[ev666il]

The problem is, new Opeth doesn't quite sound death metal




FTW, the Necrophagist album in the video in post #44 has a DR of 8db and clips in every single track. We're doing quite bad if that's what is used as anti-Loudness War reference...

[ev666il]

The new Edguy album is dynamic.

You read that.

Dy-effing-namic.

Here is what Tobias Sammet had to say about it:

The more I listen to what's going on in the Heavy Metal world these days, the more I long for drums that sound like drums. I want them to sound powerful without sounding like Atari. Sascha and I came to the conclusion that we have to start from scratch and do things the way they have to be done, not the fashionable way. I don't want a distorted master-copy, just so it is loud enough on an iPhone or on PC-speakers. If you talk to your most fancy producer he will say something like: "Well, it's the sign of the times, you have to be able to compete in the loudness war..." What the fuck?! If I want it to be loud I turn up the stereo. I want dynamics, room, a real big sound, not that distorted trendy compression. Why don't we all move back a little and record great sounding music, not loud sounding music? Do a Google search for "loudness war" and you'll see what I mean.

Can he get a big, fat AMEN from the audiophile world?

Here is the album's entry on the DR Database. If it wasn't, like, totally NOT my kind of metal I would buy it right away.

[ev666il]

I pulled the trigger on the Edguy album after all. I wanted to do my part in showing the music industry that dynamic records sell just as much as compressed ones (plus some songs have really grown on me). As of today, Age of the Joker has made it to the 25th position on the worldwide Top 50 chart before the album was even out in Canada and the U.S. (my copy was bought today from the U.S. too, so my purchase wasn't decisive to their current chart position LOL). To hell with the Loudness War.

[ev666il]

Here is a very interesting article by Ian Shepherd on how the vinyl version of RHCP's "I'm with you" is better than its CD counterpart because of a different, more dynamic master. You can check it by yourself through this video:

Also, everyone please sign up to the END THE LOUDNESS WAR Facebook campaign.

[ev666il]

Dynamic Range Day 2012 will be global - Organize your local meetup to support the event here.

For more information, check the link for Dynamic Range Day in my signature or like their Facebook page.

[ev666il]

What is compression? Sponges hold the answer A very nice and informative post by Ian Shepherd about data compression vs dynamic compression in audio.

[ev666il]

Extremely good video about the Loudness War and dynamic range, especially for audio rookies who are not yet acquainted with the phenomenon. I should probably add it to the first page of this thread.

speed: I will comment on that Alan Parson interview you posted, I have not forgotten.

[ev666il]

[ev666il]

The Loudness War: An open letter

[ev666il]

[ev666il]

[ev666il]

Loudness has no impact on sales - Update

[AVJeff]

I have been trying to teach my 17 year old about sound quality but its an uphill battle. Kids these days just don't get it. Man when I was his age I was all about wanting to know what were the best sound systems, how it all worked etc. Kids these days are oblivious; very sad. One would have thought with the High-res options on blu-ray we would be getting more music in True-HD or DTS HD but that does not yet seem to be the case.